This is an explicit episode. If you are uncomfortable with swearing, you may not want to listen to or read this episode transcription.
Katy Starr (00:01):
Hi, I'm Katy.
Dr. Tania Cubitt (00:02):
And I'm Dr. Cubitt. We're going beyond the barn. Come join us on this journey as we bust equine and livestock nutrition, myths, and interview some of the most intriguing experts in the country.
Katy Starr (00:15):
We'll go behind the scenes of how premium Western quality forage is grown and brought to your favorite farm and ranch retail store. We're so glad you're here. Welcome back to the Beyond the Barn podcast. We had so much to chat about, I'm so excited to share part two of my interview with Clinton Anderson with you all on this bonus episode today.
So over the years, given all of your experiences, your connection with horses and working with people, what would you say that you've learned the most about yourself through all of it?
Clinton Anderson (00:53):
Might sound a bit negative, but it's the truth. I have a healthy distrust for human beings, and I use the word healthy distrust. When I was young, I used to have an attitude as everybody's innocent til proven guilty. So if you're gonna steal outta my wallet, I'll leave my wallet on the counter and if you steal a hundred dollars out of it, then you're guilty. Now I have an attitude of I'm not gonna leave my wallet out and I'm not gonna make it easy for you to steal from me. So now I have an attitude is everybody's guilty until proven innocent. And so I don't trust human beings very much anymore. And now I do some of course, but when I first meet you, instead of having an attitude of, I trust you until you screw me, now I have an attitude of you're probably gonna screw me, and if you don't, then I'll, then I'll trust you.
Clinton Anderson (01:37):
You get what I'm saying? And some people, some people might look at that and say, well, you are negative and you are this and you are that well, that's, I'm not gonna argue that point. But I also say at some point, when you have enough shit stolen from you and enough shit taken from you, you can either wise up and get smart, or you can be naive and stick your head in the sand and let people take from you. So I have a famous saying, this, employees will do what you inspect, not expect.
Katy Starr (02:07):
Clinton Anderson (02:08):
And that's humans in general. People will do what you inspect, not expect. So when you know, when they know you're not gonna inspect their work, they'll f*ck off on you. They'll steal from you. They'll do all kinds of bad shit to you. I think when you are really, really poor and you're really, really rich, you see the worst of the human race and I'll explain why. So when you are really poor, let's say you're raised in the ghetto and you are poor. Even though you are poor, everybody else around you is poor as well and so if you get, everybody's trying to steal your shit, everybody's trying to survive. They're trying to steal, if you have anything of wealth, they wanna steal it because everybody's just trying to survive. So that's a shitty way to live. Well, the opposite of that is if you are really rich or you have a lot of money. When you have a lot of money, believe it or not, you know want the biggest stress of it is?
Clinton Anderson (03:00):
People trying to take it from you. People stealing from you. When you have assets, people steal from you all the f*cking time or try to. Now, when you are middle America, like I live in a subdivision, homes are probably, you know, $300,000 home, it's what I call middle America. Okay. You know, 2000 square foot home, mom and dad raising a couple of kids. That's the neighborhood I live in. Now I could have a big fancy house, but it's me and Kristen living there and a dog, we don't need a big fancy house. We don't have kids. I wanted a small place, easy to take care of. So we, we have neighbors all around us. It's the first time in my career that I've ever lived in a neighborhood like this.
Clinton Anderson (03:45):
I've always lived on the ranch that I trained out of or owned. I've never lived in suburbia. How about we say that? Okay. So I have f*cking neighbors on either side of me. And so I own a bunch of rental property in the neighborhood that I live. So, you know, there are 1800 to 2000 square foot homes. The range of these homes is anywhere from 275,000 to 325. So we've got a gauge of what kind of house it is now. You know what I mean? A subdivision. Middle America, in my neighborhood, you could leave the door unlocked most of the time. Everybody's just trying to raise a family. They're good people around me. They got small children. There's a park right down the road that the kids play at. These are people just trying to make a living, raise some good kids and get along in the world.
Clinton Anderson (04:35):
So if you lived in that neighborhood, you'd probably have a pretty optimistic view of the human race. Nobody's trying to steal from you. Nobody's trying to f*cking steal your car as soon as you get out of it, nobody's trying to carjack you, et cetera, but because you are living around people that are not desperate for survival. But when you are dirt poor, everybody's trying to survive. So if you've got something that they can benefit from, they're gonna steal it from you from a heartbeat. Opposite is true. When you've got a lot of money, people that get around you are constantly trying to take it because they want it. They want what you have. So you could either be naive about it and stick your f*cking head in the sand and act like this shit doesn't happen or you can be aware of it and try to protect yourself.
Clinton Anderson (05:26):
Like a guy told me one time, he said, don't make it easy for people to steal from you. Don't leave your wallet out with the cash out where it's easy for people to steal from you. At least put the wallet in your pocket and hide it. Does that make sense? And you can, you can say I'm a negative piece of shit. I don't care. But it's reality of life. That's why people like listening to the shit I say, because I'm speaking about the shit that's real. This is not the shit that's in the Disney movie. This is the shit that's actually real.
Katy Starr (05:53):
Well and I think your experience is valid, right? Like you used to think, you used to have that more positive mindset. You wanted to have that more positive mindset, but clearly that changed because of experiences that you had, right?
Clinton Anderson (06:06):
Oh yes. I've had, I've had hundreds of thousands of dollars stolen from me. I've had hundreds of thousands of hours stolen from me, from employees. I've had friends steal from me. I mean like, you know, these experiences come from, you know, one of the negatives of being raised, I have very, very good parents. So I was raised in middle class Australia. We weren't rich. We weren't poor. So I was raised by great, great parents that teach not to steal, teach you not to take what doesn't belong to. They teach you to work hard, et cetera. I will say this. One of the negatives of having really good raising from parents that teach you not to steal or lie. The negative of that is you kind of grow up a little bit naive that you think everybody thinks like you, that's not the case.
Katy Starr (06:55):
Right. Oh, that is so true.
Clinton Anderson (06:57):
And I was very naive in my twenties that, you know, you could leave your purse in my car and there could be a thousand dollars in your purse, but it would literally never f*cking cross my mind that if you got out in a gas station to go to the restroom that I would take the time to go through your purse and steal a hundred dollars outta your wallet. That was so far from my f*cking mind I'd have a better conception of trying to land on the moon. Does that make sense?
Katy Starr (07:27):
Clinton Anderson (07:28):
But I was raised like that. I was raised like that, but what I found out in life, is a lot of people are not raised like that. So they would not have a problem in the world if you got out of a gas station and you left your purse in the car, but they would rummage through your wallet and take out two, three hundred dollars when you're taking a piss and come back and smile at you and say, hey, how is everything? Great let's get to the next destination. You can say I'm negative, but that's human nature. Don't make it easy for people to take advantage of you.
Katy Starr (08:03):
Well, and that's the thing is sometimes the nicest of people, they do get taken advantage of for that reason.
Clinton Anderson (08:11):
You know what, the human race is two types of people. It's either sheep or wolves, pick your f*cking team. I hate to say it like that, but it's the truth. You're either a sheep and you get eaten or you're a wolf and you eat. I know Disneyland and f*cking Pocahontas is a whole nother world, a whole nother focus on life. That there's no, there's a middle animal there. That's not a sheep and not a wolf. But really when you analyze the world, it's two types of people. You're either gonna be a survivor and not be taken advantage of and be a wolf, or you're gonna be a sheep and people are gonna slaughter you. Take your pick. Now, Disneyland, you know, Disney promotes a whole nother level that everybody's sheep and we all love each other. That's a f*cking fantasy. That's just not true.
Katy Starr (08:56):
I wish it was though, dang it!
Clinton Anderson (08:57):
I wish it was too. I wish it was too, but it doesn't, it doesn't mean there's not good people in the world. There’s a lot.
Katy Starr (09:03):
Clinton Anderson (09:04):
But there's also shitty people in the world that will steal from you. They'll kill you. They'll take advantage of your family and you've gotta be aware of that.
Katy Starr (09:12):
Yeah. Awareness is important. What would you say based off all your experience, looking back, is there anything you feel like you would like to go back and do differently? Are you the type of person that says no regrets? Or what is your thought on that?
Clinton Anderson (09:28):
To be perfectly honest, I have one main regret. I wish I would've paid more attention to the money. I did fine, I retired, I got plenty. But I would've had, if I would've like right now, I sign all my own checks. I check my own credit cards. I sign off on every invoice. I am absolutely hands on involved in my money now. I've had so much money in my career stolen from me and just wasted in general, pissed away, because I always thought that like, like I'm uneducated. So I said, well, if I'll go hire the most educated people, if I'm paying an accountant $140,000 a year to be my in-house CPA, surely if I'm paying a professional that kind of money, they should be good at their job. Well, in theory, you are correct. But I figured out in life, it doesn't matter how much you pay people.
Clinton Anderson (10:18):
If they don't think you're gonna inspect their work, they will f*ck you somehow. Okay. They will shortcut you and, and not all of them, but eight outta 10 will. So I did not pay enough attention to the money in my career. I let other people sign my checks. I let other people sign off on invoices. I did not pay attention to the money. If I would've paid attention to the money the way I do now, there wouldn't have been enough banks to hold the money. That's probably my biggest regret is not paying attention to the money because I thought that if I was paying you a high amount of money, that you are a working professional, you should be, you should have my back. Again, it comes back to what I said, nine outta 10 employees will do what you inspect, not expect. One outta 10 will do what you expect, regardless.
Clinton Anderson (11:06):
They're just that type of person. Okay. They will do what's right. No matter what, but they are 10% of people. So you ask me the truth, you asked me and I will answer it truthfully. My regret is I didn't pay enough attention to the money. Sign your own checks, check your own credit cards. I'll give you a perfect example of what happened to me in my business. One year there towards the end I almost went bankrupt. It's kind of embarrassing, but I grossed like 14,000,000 one year and the same year I lost 375,000. It was the first year that I ever lost money in business. And I was embarrassed that I collected that much money and still lost money. So I'm almost bankrupt. Like, I'm upside down. So I get heavily involved in my finances and I start signing every check, checking every invoice.
Clinton Anderson (11:55):
And I come across a credit card statement from one of the guys in my office and my warehouse manager that had a, no, my truck driver that had a f*cking company credit card. This is back in the days where 7, 8, 9 people had credit cards, blah, blah, blah. And I see this charge for $250 for XM radio. So I call this guy into my office and I said, hey, what's this credit card statement for $250 for XM radio? And he said, oh, I got XM radio for the truck, for me to drive the truck. And I said, who gave you permission to spend $250 of my money and just put XM radio in the f*cking truck? He said the warehouse manager. So I called the warehouse manager in, I sat him down and I said, did you give this guy permission to spend $250 of my money and just put XM radio in the truck?
Clinton Anderson (12:49):
And he said, yeah. And then at that point, the truck driver guy, he used to drive my truck on tours, he gets a little kind of belligerent. And he says, well, it's only $13 a month. Kinda gave the impression I was making a big f*cking deal outta nothing. Okay. And he says to me, well, it's only $13 a month. And I said, great. If it's only $13 a month, you won't mind paying it will you? You should have seen this mother f*ckers face. I mean, he looked at me like I had three heads and I said, you just made a comment. You said it's only $13 a month. It's not that much money. You'll be happy to pay it. Correct? I said, so I want you to pay for this XM radio. What do you think he did?
Clinton Anderson (13:31):
He canceled that XM radio. That's what he did. He canceled it. Do you know what lesson that taught me? When people are spending their own money, they give a f*ck. When they're spending your money they don't give a shit. That was a valuable lesson right there. So that was the start of my whole new career of checking every invoice, checking every credit card, checking every check, signing my own checks. So you asked me if I had a regret, this is my regret. I wish I would've been more diligent on checking on the money. Because if I would've been, I could have retired five years earlier with twice as much money. Now, again, I don't wanna give the impression everybody's like that, cuz they're not, okay. I did not use the word all, but I will say this. When it comes to money, you are better off having a very healthy distrust of people than being naive and gullible like me and trusting people and then wake up and realize you've been robbed. I could have lied to you in that answer and could have made up some bullshit I regretted, you know, not doing this, but I told you the f*cking truth. That was the truth. That was my biggest regret in my career is not paying attention to the money.
Katy Starr (14:40):
It's important to be authentic and true. And God forbid, anybody else is in this similar situation. Like you just think about those type of things. And just knowing if you could save the heartache and the struggle for somebody else, why wouldn't you?
Clinton Anderson (14:53):
I talk to a lot of business owners and a lot of my friends own their own businesses. And I'm gonna say something that will shock a lot of people and piss a lot of people off at the same time. You will be shocked at how many people that are in the accounting industry, that steal from you. People that are bookkeepers and accountants, people that are theoretically supposed to be the shepherds of your money, the shepherds of integrity and honesty. You would be absolutely f*cking shocked if you actually knew how many accountants and bookkeepers are stealing from their employees, when they're not being checked on it, it would shock you, you'd be horrified. And every time it happens, it's a similar story to me. The owner is too busy hustling. He's too busy making money. He's not signing his own checks. He's not opening his own mail.
Clinton Anderson (15:43):
If you do these three things, you're pretty much guaranteed not to get f*cked, open your own mail so that you know what mail's coming in. Check your own credit card statements and any credit card that employees have got and sign your own checks and sign off on your own invoices. If you do those four simple things, you're almost guaranteed to ward off 98% of theft. Those things alone. But if you don't do those things, you are literally opening the gate for the wolf to walk into the sheep pen. Maybe you should ask me another question that I could say something positive.
Katy Starr (16:18):
We'll get around to it. Right?
Clinton Anderson (16:23):
Everybody started drinking about half an hour ago. They go f*ck, the human race is over.
Katy Starr (16:28):
No. Hey, I got a good question. Okay. What experience over, you know, all your years that you've been working and doing all this stuff, what did you love and would really want to relive that experience again?
Clinton Anderson (16:41):
Mm. What do I wanna relive? Shit.
Katy Starr (16:46):
I like to ask the tough questions.
Clinton Anderson (16:49):
I really wanna say something positive. Honestly. I don't wanna relive any of it. Honest to God truth. I don't wanna relive any of it. It was a lot of f*cking hard work. It was a lot of hard work. It was a lot of sacrifice. I don't wanna relive any of it. I'm glad I did it. When I took on Downunder Horsemanship, I was 21 years old and I was too f*cking stupid to know any better. Nobody told me what it was gonna be. So I just did it. You get what I'm trying to say.
Katy Starr (17:16):
You had to kinda learn yourself.
Clinton Anderson (17:19):
Yeah. So I'm not saying there wasn't some fun times of it. There was, but what I remember of my career was a shitload of work. Now I'm having fun now. I enjoy the employees that I got now, they are kind of like family. I'm down to eight. I enjoy what I do every day. I'm having a lot of fun now. I will say that now. Now I'm having a ton of fun. But in my career, I wouldn't really say there's anything that I want to go back and redo again cuz I just don't. Like I said, work your ass off the first half and hopefully live long enough to enjoy the second half or f*ck off the first half and just have fun and you'll be forced to work and get a paycheck to the day you drop dead on the second half.
Katy Starr (18:04):
Clinton Anderson (18:04):
You know what I mean? So I, I know it doesn't sound real romantic, but that's the truth of it. But you're better off working hard in your twenties and thirties when you've got energy. Cuz let me tell you, when you start getting into your fifties, sixties and seventies, you don't have the energy you used to have. Does that make sense?
Katy Starr (18:20):
Yeah. Well and the reality of it is too, if it was fun and easy, everybody would be doing it.
Clinton Anderson (18:25):
Everybody would f*cking do it. You're absolutely right.
Katy Starr (18:28):
And that's the whole point. The ones that kind of rise above and become successful in whatever, like you said, whatever avenue you deem to be success for you.
Clinton Anderson (18:39):
You're gonna do a minimum of 12 to 14 hours a day. If you want to be successful at anything you want to do. If you're not doing a minimum of 12 hours, more like 14 hours a day, six days a week, you're not going to be successful. Take your pick now unless you're a member of the lucky sperm club and I f*cking wasn't a member of that, where your parents are loaded and they get to leave you a shitload of money. Unless you're a member of that club. You're screwed. I always had the attitude that there is no money when my parents die. I always had that attitude.
Katy Starr (19:10):
Well, it's not like you're entitled to it technically. Right?
Clinton Anderson (19:14):
No. Parents that are listening to this that have got money. Let me give you a little f*cking advice here. You know, parents always get pissed at me and say so what, what kind of advice do you got and you don't have any kids. I'll tell you some advice. Okay. Leave your kids shit. Make sure your kids know that they're not gonna get any f*cking money. Okay. Because the worst thing you can do to your children is make them believe there's something at the end of the rainbow for 'em. When I die, the money's gonna be pissed away. So you better get off your ass and go make your own money. Even if you plan on leaving, 'em some inheritance, guess what you do, lie to 'em, tell 'em there's nothing. Lie to 'em, so that when you drop dead and there's some money there, great. There's an old expression with wealthy people. Okay. Leave your kids enough that they have to do something, but don't leave them enough that they can do nothing.
Katy Starr (20:02):
Right, that's good.
Clinton Anderson (20:03):
You get my drift.
Katy Starr (20:04):
Yep. I sure do.
Clinton Anderson (20:05):
You know what I mean? One time I watched a interview with Gordon Ramsey, you know the chef. And I love Gordon Ramsey. And one of the interview people said, you know about he’s, you know, he's worth millions and millions of dollars. And he said to his, Gordon Ramsey said something about what are you gonna leave your kids? And he said, I'm not gonna leave my kids f*cking anything. He said, f*ck 'em. I paid for their education. I bought 'em a house each, f*ck 'em they're on their own. And I f*ckin loved it. I thought it was the funniest shit.
Katy Starr (20:31):
That's a lot! He paid for their education and house? He still gave them a lot.
Clinton Anderson (20:37):
It is a lot! Yes! I love those RV buses. When you driving down the road, there's like a million dollar, $2 million well they're more than a million now. They're like two, $2 million Prevost bus driving down the road and it's got a bumper sticker on the back that says I'm spending my kids’ inheritance. I love that shit. I love it. So, so I always had the attitude that there's no plan B for me. When I come to America, I'm on my own. I have to make this work. So the biggest thing that you can do to ruin your kids is give them too much shit. They have to struggle. They have to get some bloody noses on the playground to figure out how the world works. If you make things too easy for 'em, they turn into weaklings. Even myself. Now that I've got money, I'm not hungry like I used to be.
Clinton Anderson (21:21):
Do you know what I mean by hungry? It's like, I know this'll be a bit of a cliché, you'll go laugh at it and say, you know, it's kind of stupid, but it's kind of like the old Rocky movies, you know, Rocky one, the mother f*cker’s broke and borderline homeless and he's got nothing, but he's got everything to gain because he's just willing to work. And when Rocky gets famous and makes all that money, Rocky three turns into a pussy, gets his ass whipped. I can relate to that. I don't have anywhere near the ticker now that I'm retired, that what I had 20 years ago. I was savage 20 years ago. I was savage. Because I was hungry. You get my drift? When you're a parent and you've got money and you make it too easy on your kids, you're just crippling these little pricks. That's all you're doing. You're crippling them. You're setting them up for a false sense of what f*cking reality is. Kick those pricks outta the house and make 'em live on their own. Make 'em pay their own bills. Make 'em struggle. When they call you up bawling and crying and I've got no money say, well, it's great listening to you. See you at Christmas mother f*cker. you know what I mean? That's what you need to do for 'em. But that's a fact.
Katy Starr (22:29):
It's hard. It's hard for parents, but, you're not wrong at all. Because even as a parent, when you love your child so much, you wanna make sure that you give them everything and they have everything they need. But at the same time, like, and I'm saying this from the perspective of a parent to young kids is if I love my kids so much, I'm also gonna teach them the skills they need to be able to survive being an adult by themself. So I hear you.
Clinton Anderson (22:56):
Yes. You can give them love. You can give them support and you can give them the gift of education. Beyond that, f*ck 'em. They're on their own.
Katy Starr (23:05):
They gotta struggle.
Clinton Anderson (23:06):
They gotta paddle their own canoe. The old saying of you've gotta get a few bloody noses to figure out how the playground works is really true. See, f*ck it I'll say it anyway. Boys know this more than girls. Okay. Boys know this shit more than girls. Meaning this, as a boy, a little boy, when we are on the playground, little boys we learn from a very, and this never leaves their body even into adulthood. This stays with us our entire lives until we die. We know as boys, call it boys, men, whatever. If I mouth off to another man or another boy, I'm gonna get a bloody nose. So as little kids we know on the playground, if we mouth off to somebody or start talking shit or start stirring trouble, boys, men will get physical very quickly. And it'll turn into a fist fight as little kids, as I got in millions of fist fights as a kid. Okay.
Clinton Anderson (23:59):
Even as adults, even now, if I'm mouth off to some guy at a bar and I act disrespectful to a guy, I'm gonna get into a fist fight and I'm gonna get a bloody nose. Does that make sense? Men, we know there's a line in the sand. All men know there's like an imaginary line in the sand that if we f*cking cross it, it's gonna get ugly. I don't think typically women know that that line's there as much because little girls can get pissed at each other, but rarely does it end up in a physical altercation, does it?
Katy Starr (24:32):
No. But we're also taught to be, society kind of teaches us to be...
Clinton Anderson (24:36):
What I'm saying is you can still hate each other, but it typically, it doesn't end up in a physical confrontation. I'm not saying girls don't fight, cuz they do. But not like boys, boys it's instinct, isn't it? There's an altercation. Fists are flying on the playground quickly. Girls kind of, can mouth off to each other, but there's really not a big physical price to pay for that. Does that make sense? So, so now there might be social ramifications. You might lose your friends. You might get kicked out of the cliquey group. You know, there's, that's how they get punished. They get punished in social aspects like that. But boys get punished in physical ways. Okay. So what I'm saying is, you know, there's bloody noses for boys and there's mental bloody noses for girls. How about we say that?
Katy Starr (25:22):
Yep. No, that's a good way to put it.
Clinton Anderson (25:24):
So when I say as a metaphor, you gotta get a few bloody noses to figure out how the f*cking playground works. That's something you can't teach children. They have to learn themselves. You have to let them learn what the playground is in life. You can warn 'em about the playground. You can give them some good advice, but ultimately, it's their shit to get their own bloody nose. So just like if you're poor, a lack of resources can really hurt educating your children because you can't send 'em to a good school. You can't buy the right books. You know, you can't get 'em to extra sporting events. You can't give them the education they need when you're really, really poor. I agree with that. But the opposite is true when you're really, really rich and you give your children an abundance of everything, they turn into shitheads typically.
Clinton Anderson (26:16):
So there's a middle ground there. There's a middle ground there where more wealth doesn't produce a better child. And people laugh at me and people say, you know, what the f*ck would, you know? You've never had any children. True. But I've raised a lot of people's kids in my career. I've had hundreds of kids come through my academy. Hundreds of kids come through my apprenticeships and clinics. And I can tell you without a doubt, the children that come from money on average, I did not use the word all cuz there's always one f*cking parent that says my kid’s different. Congratulations. F*ck you. Okay. But as a general rule, a overwhelming general rule, the children that come from wealthy parents are the biggest shitheads. They are the laziest. They are the most unmotivated. They typically don't have the passion. As a general rule, the children that come from middle class parents, middle class America or poor backgrounds have more try, more desire, more effort, they hustle.
Clinton Anderson (27:19):
I’m not, did not use the word all there either. Cuz there's some kids that come from poor or middle backgrounds that are shitheads too. Okay. We're talking generalities and, and people always like to say people always like to think there are exception to the rule just because you might be an exception to the rule, doesn't mean the f*cking rule doesn't exist. The rule's there. You know what I mean? So the more, I believe, that you give kids, there's a line when you cross it, you're actually hurting these kids. I remember one of my apprentices at the time, her name was Shayna. She went to, it was in high school and went to college and she told me this story and then I never forgot it. She said, when I left for college, I was really angry with my parents. When I moved in, I had to move into a apartment by myself.
Clinton Anderson (28:04):
And she said, I moved outta high school, went to college and got an apartment by myself. And she said, I remember being really angry at my parents. And I said, why were you so angry? And she said, because they didn't set me up for success. They set me up for failure. And I said, what do you mean? She said, I'm embarrassed to tell you this, but I'm gonna tell you it anyway. She said, I didn't have any basic skills. She said, I remember the light was out in the kitchen. And I had to call the superintendent, the guy that runs the apartment complex. And I had to call him to tell him that the light was out and the guy came over and said the light bulbs blowing, why didn't you change it? And she said, I'm embarrassed, but I didn't know how to change it.
Clinton Anderson (28:45):
She said, I didn't know how to do my own laundry. I didn't know how to check the tire pressure of my own car. She said, I'm embarrassed, but I had to learn all of that at 18-19 when I should have been taught that as a kid. I should have been taught to do my own f*cking laundry. I should have been taught how to change a light bulb. I should have been taught how to change a tire. I should have been doing that shit. But she said, I felt really angry at my parents because I felt like they protected me so f*cking much, that when I got out my own, I was like lost. I never forgot that conversation. I thought that was very true.
Katy Starr (29:23):
Yea, and that's unfortunate. It's really a simple concept, but I think people sometimes overlook that.
Clinton Anderson (29:28):
Yes. You know, when your kid's 13, f*ck 'em make them do their own laundry. Make 'em pay board, make 'em pay 25% of any money they make towards electric and board, the rent to be there. It's not about the money. It's about teaching them that life is not free. Say get in line mother f*cker, life ain't free, so get in line. It's like I have to laugh at all these dipshits that love socialism and shit. You know, they’ll say Australia has socialized medicine. So all these assholes in the world think that Canada and f*cking Australia and f*cking Switzerland have these wonderful Medicare medical programs. Let me tell you how it works in Australia. If you are a woman in Australia and you go have a baby, guess what? You pay for nothing. You can go have your baby.
Clinton Anderson (30:11):
Everything's paid for. If you are a kid and you break your arm, you go to the hospital, but put a cast on your arm. No bill. But guess what? If you have to have a kidney operation or you have to have a hernia or you have to have any operation that's not life threatening, guess what you get? You get to be put on a waiting list. And guess when you get into hospital, whenever it suits them, it could be a year later, two years later, three years later. So everybody thinks that that free medicine is free. It ain't f*ckin free. Australia is taxed at a rate that is unheard of. We are taxed for everything in Australia. One of the highest tax rates in the world. Nothing's free. So you might say you get to have a baby for free. Bullshit you paid for that in taxes. That's how you paid for that baby.
Katy Starr (30:58):
Came from someone.
Clinton Anderson (31:00):
Take my parents, for example. My parents were middle class in Australia. Guess what? We had private health insurance. Do you know why we had private health insurance? So that if one of us kids got sick and we needed a hospital, we wouldn't have to be put on a waiting list. We got to go to the hospital, a private hospital, cuz we had private health insurance. Does that make sense? So it's easy to say shit’s free. Nothing's free. Why do you think Canadians and, and every other country in the world come to America for most of their medical needs for major operations, because they can't get that medicine where they f*cking live that's why. I'm not saying that the medical industry's not f*cked up over here. It kind of is. The best way to fix the medical industry over here is open up to let everybody compete against each other. Healthy competition, open up the borders, let everybody compete. That'll drop the price to begin with. But what I'm getting at is, back to that parent deal is, the more parents that have got money to give these kids the worse they set these kids up to fail.
Katy Starr (32:02):
Yeah. It's so true. I wanted to ask you, what would you say is a bucket list item? I mean you only got till 60, right?
Clinton Anderson (32:10):
F*ck yes. I gotta get moving.
Katy Starr (32:11):
So what is your bucket list item? What do you wanna do in your life that you haven't done yet? But it's on your bucket list. You gotta do it.
Clinton Anderson (32:20):
My bucket list. I honestly, I just want to have fun now and I want to enjoy my family and people around me. Like I'm gonna go back to Australia every six months and see my parents. My dad's just got diagnosed with Parkinson's Disease and I haven't seen them a lot. So I'm gonna go back to Australia every six months and see my parents for a week or two. I'm gonna hang out with friends a lot more. I'm gonna see relatives more. I'm gonna hang out with positive people. My goal is just to have fun, just to be perfectly blunt with you because I've done a lot of f*ckin things to get retired that weren't a lot of fun. So my goal is just to be around positive people, have fun and only do things that I enjoy. So some of that might be traveling. I don't really know, but I'll know if it's fun. I know I want to do it. If it ain't fun. I know I'm not gonna do it.
Katy Starr (33:07):
Clinton Anderson (33:07):
That may not be the answer you're looking for, but I wanna, I haven't, I left home when I was 15 years old. I really, I'm 46 now. I really haven't seen my parents much since I was 15 years old. So I want to catch up with them more. They're 70, a little over 70 now. So while they're still around, I want to, I want to try to catch up on family, which most business owners that have made a lot of money, all say one thing, that they were working so much that they never got to see their family. And that's the truth. Because I have a little saying and it's the truth. When everything's important, nothing's important. You can only focus on one thing at a time. And typically when you are really focused on your career and business, family, friends, and other things will deteriorate.
Clinton Anderson (33:51):
And then hopefully you've saved yourself enough that you can circle background and pick some of those subjects back up again. Now the opposite is true. I don't begrudge people or look down on people that put family first. In fact, that's why I never had children because I knew I'd pick my career. So when there's family, when people are focused on family, there's nothing wrong with that. And I think that's a great goal. But at the same time they can't bitch that they don't have a lot of money. Like take my partner, Kristin, her brother has three kids. Him and his wife have three kids. You can just tell, but this f*cking couple, they love children. They love their kids. You can just tell they enjoy being parents. They don't have a lot of money, but they sure as shit pay attention to those kids.
Clinton Anderson (34:36):
They know what they're doing. They know where they're at. They educate 'em. They don't have a lot of money, but they really invest their time and resources. What money and resources they have, they really invest in the children. Okay. I think that's admirable. I don't look down on that at all, but they also don't bitch that they don't have four TVs. They also don't bitch that they don't go on elaborate vacations. They also don't that they don't have a nice car to drive. Do you get what I'm saying? Because they've made a conscious choice to invest their time, money and resources into those three children, which I think is awesome. I wanna make that very clear.
Katy Starr (35:14):
No that's their view of success. Right? So it's great.
Clinton Anderson (35:17):
That’s exactly right. And nor do I hold it against people like me, that chose to make money. Does that make sense? That doesn't make me the devil either.
Katy Starr (35:25):
No, I think that's, I mean, great that you also made the choice not to have kids because you knew that you probably couldn't be as present as you should be.
Clinton Anderson (35:33):
I was gonna be a shitty dad because I knew I would've picked my career. My first wife, I was married nine and a half years. She wanted the American dream. She wanted three kids, picket fence, f*ckin minivan, soccer, you know, the whole bullshit, she wanted that whole dream. And that wasn't my dream. I had a dream to build a business, build a career, build a legacy. So we were just completely mismatched. Why? Because she was 18 when I married and I was 21 and we didn't know the difference in love and lust. We were just stupid, dumb kids. That's all we were. Goes back to what I said, don't get married or have children before 30. Okay. But I made my bed. I slept in as long as I could, but I deliberately didn't have children. She wanted children very early, but I knew I was too driven on my career. I was too driven in my business. I did not wanna be a deadbeat dad. So when you have children, they sure as shit better be your focus. And if you are a businessman and making a lot of money, you better have a woman there that's taking care of them that really is invested in those kids. Because if you're not, they turn into shitheads.
Katy Starr (36:35):
Yep. Who would you say in your life has been your greatest inspiration?
Clinton Anderson (36:39):
Oh, obviously my parents have got me a great foundation. My parents taught me the most valuable lesson I ever got in my whole life, which is a work ethic. You know, work ethic will cure 99% of problems in the world, just having a work ethic. So them, I would say taught me that and a lot of other things, but that's the biggest thing. My mentor is Gordon McKinlay, who passed away, and Ian Francis two of my greatest mentors when it comes to the horses. So I would say those three people had the biggest influence on me. You can do a lot of things in life to f*ck up in life. But if you'll just do these two basic things every day, get up and go to work and work hard. If you'll just do that and you'll pay attention to your money, you almost can't half screw up in life. If you'll just do those two basic things, get up and work hard every day and the money you make, pay attention to it and where you're spending it. You can almost be guaranteed at least an average to a better of an average life. If you can just not f*ck those two basic things up right there.
Katy Starr (37:42):
It's a good chunk of it. That's for sure.
Clinton Anderson (37:45):
Seriously, nobody ever drowned in their own sweat. I'm a living proof of how lack of talent. Doesn't matter. I've been the first to say there's many other horsemen that are more talented than me and better than me, at training a horse, but I was better at working than them. I outworked them. So I'm living proof you don't have to be that talented to be number one. In fact, the most naturally gifted people typically never see their careers get to where they need to be. Because most naturally gifted people, whether it's sports, playing a musical instrument, whatever it is, not all, I did not use the word all, but most naturally gifted people have a tendency to f*ck off their talent because it came so easy for 'em and it came so natural. They don't know what the grind is, where dumb asses like me, that weren't very talented.
Clinton Anderson (38:34):
F*ck I had to grind it out. I had to really work at my skill set to get good because I didn't have any natural ability to pull from. As far as training a horse. Yes. I did have natural gift of the gab and I had a natural ability to talk to people. But as far as training a horse, man, that was a f*ckin grind. I had to work at that hard because I had no natural ability there. Now the odd person has natural talent and is a workaholic, that guy's unstoppable. I'll be the first to admit that that man or woman is literally unstoppable. But you know how hard that is. We're talking about Michael Jordans now.
Katy Starr (39:08):
Yeah. Yeah. Well, look at Michael Jordan though. Got cut from his high school basketball team. Right. Didn't he? So.
Clinton Anderson (39:14):
That's right. Oh yeah. I just read a book about him. Yes. But he had natural talent, but he also had a phenomenal work ethic.
Katy Starr (39:21):
He worked hard.
Clinton Anderson (39:22):
He worked very hard. Very hard. I can't remember the name of the book. I just read about him, but it was, he worked extremely hard. And when you really analyze people that worked really hard, there's not a lot of fun there, I'll be honest.
Katy Starr (39:34):
It's hard to have both hand in hand.
Clinton Anderson (39:36):
You can't. I don't think you can, to be honest, I don't think you can have fun and work hard because it's so, most people in life are not lucky enough to make a lot of money from something they really love to do. I'm not saying there are not people that can't do it. Cuz there is. But most of us do shit that we don't necessarily love, but we make good money doing it so that's why we keep doing it. Most of the shit that humans do, if we could really do the thing, what we love to do and you say, well, why don't you go do that? You'll look at me and say, well, cuz it doesn't really ever gonna make any money. You know what I mean? It doesn't really pay that well.
Katy Starr (40:14):
Yeah, it doesn't pay the bills. Yep.
Clinton Anderson (40:16):
I'm not saying everybody, but the vast majority of adults and that's not being bad, that's just facing reality.
Katy Starr (40:22):
Nope. That's true. When I was kind of preparing for this episode, I came across, I don't know if you knew this, but you have one of those pages where it's like Clinton's top quotes. And I came across one that I really liked. And it said, you had said always be humble enough to learn something new otherwise it's only a matter of time before your knowledge becomes outdated. And just in, in all that you do, whenever you're communicating with people, I've noticed that you make a point to credit people who inspire you or influence you. And you're also able to identify your limits. And when to look for others who may know more than you do in a certain area to kind of grow and improve yourself. Can you talk to us a little bit about what this quote means to you and how you apply it to your life?
Clinton Anderson (41:10):
I have a saying that your greatest strength is also your greatest weakness. Okay. Every human being has got great strengths, natural in innate strengths about you. So whatever your greatest strengths is as a human is also what I call the back of the hand, which is also your biggest Achilles heel. So take me, for example, you could say my strength is I'm a great communicator. I'm a good bullshitter. I got the gift of the gab. I can talk. You could say that I'm very honest and forthcoming and I tell the truth. Okay. They're all good qualities. You could say that. Okay. But the back of the hand is, I also piss a lot of people off because of my honesty. I can't f*cking lie to you. Well like whatever you ask me, if I'm gonna answer it, I will tell you the truth.
Clinton Anderson (41:55):
So the negative of telling the truth is you'll piss a lot of people off. So if Kristen says, honey, do I look fat in this dress? I'm probably gonna say, yes, you do. She ain't gonna like it, but I'm gonna tell her the truth. If she looks fat in the dress, you get my drift there? So your greatest strength is your greatest weakness. So, I communicate well, but I also rub people the wrong, a lot of people the wrong way, because I'm willing to say the truth and I'm willing to speak my mind, which is also why the other half of the team love me to death. Now the opposite is true. I know people that are very mild and meek and never stir up trouble, never cause confrontation. They never offend anybody. If you said, honey, do I look fat in this dress? They're gonna say, no, you look great. In fact, I think you've lost weight. They'll f*ckin lie to you. Like they'll they will do anything to create a ripple. Okay. So you might say, well, that's a good person. He's not out causin trouble and everybody likes him. You know, everybody enjoys his company, but what's the back of the hand? He's an unmotivated mother f*cker. This guy's never gonna go anywhere in life because he's not willing to ripple any waves. He's not willing to ripple any feathers. He's not willing to
Katy Starr (43:09):
take risks or anything like that.
Clinton Anderson (43:11):
Take risks. This guy is lazy. He'll do 40 hours a week at a factory job. He'll never stick his neck out. He'll never start his own business. He'll never do anything that, but when he dies on his deathbed, he's gonna say, man, that was f*ckin awesome. I really stuck my balls on the line and accomplished something in life. He'll never say that. So his greatest strength is he doesn't piss anybody off, but his greatest weaknesses, he never gets anywhere in life either. That's the truth to it. So to me, I've always said to myself, if I can recognize my weaknesses, try to then overcome those weaknesses. So one of my major weaknesses was I'm not very educated, meaning book smart, I didn't graduate high school. I didn't go to college. So, I'm not educated in books very well at all. Now I got very educated in street smart and how the world works, but I'm not educated on books.
Clinton Anderson (44:09):
So accounting bothered me a lot. I was really good at making money, but I couldn't read a balance sheet, you know? So areas that I was, lacked education, I tried to hire the right professionals that were strong, where I was weak. So I tried to identify every area of my life that I thought I had a weakness at and tried to say, okay, what have I gotta do, who can I hire? I've always said this. You don't have to be the smartest mother f*cker in the world. You just gotta surround yourself with the smartest guys in the world. Does that make sense? I don't have to know everything in the world, but as sure as shit gotta surround myself with people that are smart, where I'm dumb. So I've always looked at that as an asset, find out where you're not very bright.
Clinton Anderson (44:51):
Find out where your downfall is and surround yourself with people that are strong, where you are weak and vice versa. So to me it was very logical. There was no ego involved. It was just logical. I suck at this. So find somebody that's good at this and put 'em on my f*cking team. When you are, when you are playing Dodge ball, you're playing soccer and you have to, as a kid, you pick your team, you know, there's 20 people in front of you and you get to pick, I dunno if you did this in America, but in Australia, if you had to pick out of group, you know, you get to pick and then you get to pick. Does that make sense? Well, when I was, when I, if I was the guy on that team and I had to pick my soccer team, I f*cking pick people that were good at soccer.
Clinton Anderson (45:28):
I didn't pick the nerd that was good at the library cuz he sucked at playing sports. Now, if I was gonna pick a team for a debate team, that f*ckin nerd is the first mother f*cker. I pick the guy in the library. I want him on my team cuz he's gonna be the greatest debater in the world. He's gonna be so book smart, he's gonna know his shit. I don't want the jock that can kick a soccer ball down the field. Does that make sense? I picked the guys that on my team of the skillset that I need. So in business I lacked some of that educational skillset. So I surrounded myself with people that were good at that as best I could. How about we say that? So I've just realized if you know what your weaknesses are, turn them into strengths, turn your weaknesses into strengths. And now they're no longer weaknesses.
Katy Starr (46:16):
I think that's really great. I have a couple questions left that I'd like to ask you. What is the most important thing that horses have taught you in your life so far?
Clinton Anderson (46:27):
What's the most important thing horses did? Okay. You'll get outta horses, what you're willing to put into, no more, no less. And it's almost a lot like life. The more you're willing to put into your job, life, career, or family, the more you'll get out of it. So horses will only give you as much as you put into 'em. So if you only train 'em once a week, they'll kind of be shitheads. If you're willing to train 'em six days a week and put a lot of time and effort in 'em they'll ride like a million dollars. They're a reflection of your work ethic. If you are willing to work hard and put the time in, they'll be very productive citizens. If you are not willing to work hard and put the time in, they'll embarrass you and make a jackass out of themselves very quickly.
Katy Starr (47:08):
Yeah, that's a good one. That's really great. Clinton, I can't thank you enough for being on today. I think this conversation has just been fantastic. Just getting to learn a little bit more about you and where you come from and you, just your life experiences. I want to allow our listeners, if they aren't following you and would like to connect with you, how can they connect with you after this episode? Where can they find you?
Clinton Anderson (47:37):
Well obviously, you know, we have Downunder Horsemanship Facebook page you know, Instagram Downunder Horsemanship on Instagram. We have some TikTok videos Downunder Horsemanship. I personally don't have any personal social media presence. Everything's through the business. We are starting our own podcast. In the next 60 days it's gonna be called Uncut and Real Raw with Clinton Anderson.
Katy Starr (47:59):
Clinton Anderson (48:00):
And I'm gonna be interviewing people for my podcast. It's just kind of a fun project. It's not nothing to make money. It's really just a fun project. I want to interview people that are really successful in life, made a lot of money, f*cked off a lot, made a lot of mistakes and, and talk to 'em and get real and basically talk about all the shit that you're not supposed to talk about. That's the shit I want to talk about. And it's funny, you know, the stuff that you're not supposed to talk about is also the same shit everybody is thinking. And everybody wants to talk about.
Katy Starr (48:28):
Everybody wants to listen to though, right? Yea.
Clinton Anderson (48:31):
But nobody has the balls to step up and say it. So that's why it's called uncut and real raw, cuz I'm gonna get real raw, but I want to talk to really successful people. I want to talk to 'em about life and how they made their money. I want to talk to 'em about money and how they made money, how they pissed away money, what they’d do different with money. And then I wanna talk about their personal lives because most guys and women that have made a shit ton of money are typically a f*ckin train wreck in their personal lives. And they've been married three or four times. They've got 15 baby daddies and, and you know, that's the reality of that. So I want to talk about those three subjects and get a little drunk and start talking because typically alcohol is truth serum for most people.
Clinton Anderson (49:11):
So I want to get a little alcohol into them and see how real we can get. And hopefully people will have a good laugh. They'll learn a lot and enjoy it. I'm not looking to take on sponsors. I'm not saying I won't have sponsors, but I'm not looking to take on sponsors. I don't want to be held back from what I can and can't say, and I don't want to be dictated to. So I'm funding this with all my own money. We've done all the branding and marketing for it. So in the next 60 days, you'll be able to see that, you know, if you get on, if you become a Facebook follower, we'll make an announcement. And this podcast is not something we're gonna promote as a Downunder Horsemanship, how do we say, product or branding deal? This is more about me. I'm not interviewing horse people. If that makes sense.
Katy Starr (49:54):
Oh okay, yea.
Clinton Anderson (49:55):
Yeah. It's just, I'm interviewing very rich, successful men and women all over the world from other industries. So it's not gonna be a, a podcast about what does my horse bite me on the ass, it's not to do with horses. It's again, the three pillars are life, money and personal life. And, because in our personal life, we've all done things that we regret. We've all done things we weren’t proud of. And I think if people are willing to get a little naked and get raw, we can have a great time, learn a lot, and people can get a lot out of it. So I'm not, I'm not, and I'm not even promoting this to my own followers. They're welcome to follow it. They're welcome to be a part of it, but I'm not branding it as a Clinton Anderson Downunder Horsemanship thing. This is just a thing for life.
Katy Starr (50:41):
Kind of a fun project, your semi-retirement life.
Clinton Anderson (50:43):
That's exactly right. It's supposed to be fun. It's not about making money. It's not about pleasing anybody. It's just about two guys or me and there'll be women on there from time to time I'm sure, but are just willing to get a little naked, get raw and talk about shit in life, which is on everybody's mind. But most people just don't have the balls to talk about it. So I, hopefully I want people to learn about, I want 'em to enjoy it. I think there'll be a lot of laughter and a lot of fun. I like making fun of myself, cuz believe me, I've got a lot of advice, but I'll be the first to tell you I've f*cked up a lot of things in life. And I'm willing to admit it. And I admit most of the shit that I've screwed up in life because I don't want people to make the mistakes I made.
Clinton Anderson (51:23):
I am more than willing to admit where I've failed. I've done things wrong so that people can learn from it and say, I don't wanna make that mistake. I wish somebody would've told me 25 years ago, check your own credit card statements. You know, sign your own checks, check the money. I wish somebody would've had the balls to tell me that because I would've saved millions of dollars. You know? I wish somebody would've been honest enough to me to tell me that don't make it easy for people to steal. You know what I mean? Because I might have done things differently. I may not have to, but at least would've liked the warning and the heads up.
Katy Starr (51:58):
At least the awareness would've been there.
Clinton Anderson (52:00):
Awareness, that's dead set right. You know, you might say people don't steal, but you don't drop your Lamborghini off in a shitty part of town and leave it unlocked do you?
Katy Starr (52:08):
Clinton Anderson (52:09):
You know, you don't wanna get eaten by a shark. Don't f*cking swim with sharks. It's pretty simple. Don't cut your leg and then jump in the ocean and wonder why sharks bite you. I always say there's book smart in the world and street smart. I'm street smart. I'm not real book smart, but there's a lot to be said about being street smart and figuring out how the world works. So I want to talk to people that have made a lot more money than me, smarter than me. I do not wanna talk to people that are less than me. I wanna talk to people that are richer than me, smarter than me, more educated than me and better than me because not only am I asking them questions, but I'm trying to learn from them as well.
Katy Starr (52:44):
That's gonna be a good podcast. Well, thank you, Clinton. Thanks for being on today.
Clinton Anderson (52:49):
Thank you for having me, mate.
Katy Starr (52:51):
Next episode, episode 44, we are partnering up with some great organizations to go beyond the barn and support those in our lives that are battling breast cancer. Tune in next Tuesday, September 27th, to hear what we've cooked up with a therapeutic riding center, and a breast cancer nonprofit, who's received a four star rating for 17 consecutive years. Be sure to subscribe so you can hear an easy way for you to help us, help others. We'll see you next week.
Thanks for listening to the Beyond the Barn podcast by Standlee Forage. We'd love for you to share our podcast with your favorite people and subscribe on Apple, Spotify, or your favorite listening platform. Until next time, keep your cinch tight and don't forget to turn off the water.